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Cider Digest #1892
Subject: Cider Digest #1892, 14 August 2014
From: cider-request@talisman.com
Cider Digest #1892 14 August 2014
Cider and Perry Discussion Forum
Contents:
How do you "hop" cider (denniswaller@comcast.net)
start up cider house recommended floor space (Floundering in new waters ("...)
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Digest Janitor: Dick Dunn
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Subject: How do you "hop" cider
From: denniswaller@comcast.net
Date: Mon, 11 Aug 2014 04:44:17 +0000 (UTC)
On Saturday, August 9, I attended "Summer Cider Day" organized by the
Northwest Cider Association in Port Townsend, WA where I was able to choose
among 70 different ciders made by regional (WA & OR) cidermakers. I was
especially impressed by several ciders that were "hopped" but the only
information the servers were able to provide was that one cidery used
"cascade" hops and another used "CTZ" hops (an identical cultivar that
has three different names: Columbia, Tomahawk and Zeus.) All of these hops
are high alpha acid varieties, which have a strong citrus flavor and are
grown in the Yakama Valley of Washington.
I would like to learn the following information from any cidermakers who
hop their cider:
1) which variety of hops they use
2) the ratio of dry hops to a gallon of cider and
3) how long the hops are allowed to steep in the cold cider.
I should mention that I am an amateur cider maker who only ferments cider
for consumption by myself and members of my family.
Dennis Waller
Bellingham, WA
denniswaller@comcast.net
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Subject: start up cider house recommended floor space (Floundering in new waters
From: "Mc Canna, Keith" <kmccanna@dresden-is.de>
Date: Tue, 12 Aug 2014 23:41:50 +0200
This is a request for all those individuals who run small commercial hard
cider operations out there.
Before now I have simply been a hobby cider maker. But we would like to
turn this hobby into a small scale commercial operation. We are presently
in the planning stages of opening a small scale Cider House in a small city
in Europe. Within our operation we want to be able to store apples and
cider in a cold room (could be on site or at another location that we
have), mill and press apples to make our own juice and must, run primary,
secondary and tertiary fermentation tanks for up to 5 varieties / recipes
of cider, have a small lab for further experiments and artisanal trials of
new recipes as well as bottle, pasteurize, keg and label our cider on the
premises (not interested in canning) and store cider for upwards of 6
months to a year, before bottling. We would also like to have a small
tasting room with a bar and small scale Bistro with a kitchen for platters
of food as well as a small beer garden / patio. (say seating for 50
people). We hope to start our first year by producing 10,000 L of and hope
to double and triple this volume in the following years perhaps to upwards
of 50,000 L in total. We would prefer to remain in the starting location
for 4-5 years before having to expand or move to a larger location.
What I am looking for is i) information regarding floor space necessary for
such an operation (square meters would be best but square feet can be
converted.) We will either buy a place and demolish it to start new or
renovate an existing structure for our cider house. ii) Any suggestions
with respect to must haves or we should have included this in our cider
house when we started would be immensely helpful to me. iii) And any other
suggestions or ideas would be greatly appreciated.
I have included a list below of the number of different rooms and
considerations which I have anticipated / researched that we will need for
such an operation (Have I missed anything crucial?)
*Cidery Start up Realestate needs / considerations:*
*Location: (Primary concern)*
* Direct to consumer with urban retail potential
* Close to The center of the city or in a busy area of the city
* Proximity to customers / Large Park Area?
* Easy access by trucks / distribution
* Beer garden / outdoor patio restaurant
*Building Considerations:*
* Storage area / barn/ garage
* Large access doors for deliveries trucks large equipment
* Concrete floors easy clean up Washable walls and floors
* High ceilings to allow for tanks and multiple levels for
shelving & storage
* Tap room& Bar within building
* Large walk-in fridge / Freezer
*Design of Floor Plan /Facility:*
Workspace flexibility - Able to grow and change production methods over time
* Minimal fixed equipment most on wheels to move around
* Wide doors & high ceilings with Ceiling drops for electrical,
water, air, glycol, co2, no extension cords ? Inline floor drain valve to
stop chemical juice & cider spills
* Separate work stations, and safety corridors for forklifts with
turning access to stacked shelving,
* Separate break / coffee / lunch area
* Separate Washroom facilities (full) + separate sink and hand
sterilizer
* Separate office area for printers and labellers, document
storage, computers,
* Separate lab / for testing & design
* Pallet racking and warehouse/ storage area
* Cold storage for kegs/fruit/frozen juice
* Outdoor space for empty drum/tote storage, pallets, keg paddock,
shipping containers(lockable?)
* Keg washing? Storage? Logistics
* If possible separate fruit processing area from fermentation area
safety stations
? Access to additional electrical, water, air, natural gas for future
capacity increase
Floor drains and air circulation for drying
? Ample lighting
? Proper ventilation - CO2, Boilers
Energy conservation ? renewable energy options, recycling, heat exchangers,
CO2 regeneration, nightair cooling, bike racks/storage
? Wastewater treatment & Settling tanks and dispersion
Fire sprinklers, alarm systems
? Ample hot water ? extra large capacity boiler/ water heater
? Loading docks/ramps, area for tanker receiving, fruit receiving
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End of Cider Digest #1892
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